Overcoming the fear of failure with Lance Priebe (#44) — Transcript
Updated: Oct 26
THE PICTURE OF WEALTH · EPISODE 44
Dustin Serviss speaks with game developer and Club Penguin co-founder Lance Priebe about curiosity, play and moving beyond the fear of failure. They explore business, creative work and life after a major success.
Listen to the episode
This transcript was generated from the episode audio and lightly edited for readability. It may contain transcription or speaker-attribution errors. Refer to the recording for exact wording.
Chapters
[00:00:34] Introducing Lance Priebe
[00:02:51] Understanding idle games
[00:13:46] Creating space in the calendar
[00:16:55] From Penguin Chat to Club Penguin
[00:22:22] Jobs, fans and working from a backpack
[00:26:12] Risk in entertainment investing
[00:33:05] Player motivations and revenue
[00:41:39] Wealth and the people around you
[00:46:37] Skills, setbacks and starting again
[00:50:42] Health, hiking and blind spots
Guest & resources
Related episodes
Transcript
[00:00:01] Show announcer: In this episode of The Picture of Wealth, Dustin sits down with Lance Preeb, a creative catalyst and successful video game developer, to talk about games.
[00:00:10] Lance Priebe: The game is just a series of interesting choices. That's actually what the definition is.
[00:00:15] Show announcer: The importance of play.
[00:00:17] Lance Priebe: Gaming is just play. Everybody loves play. It doesn't matter who you are.
[00:00:20] Show announcer: And how vital curiosity is in terms of success.
[00:00:24] Lance Priebe: Oh, just be curious. That's it. That curiosity is gonna get you somewhere.
[00:00:29] Show announcer: So if you wanna hear all this and more, then tune in and start living more of your life now.
[00:00:34] Dustin Serviss: I had a lot of fun in this episode, and Lance is a a a class act that I've known for a long time. But the back story that I don't get into in the episode is that Lance, a guy named Dave Crisco, and a guy named Lane Merryfield started a company called Club Penguin, and then they sold to Disney and sold for its public knowledge three hundred and fifty million dollars amongst other various incentives. If you read up on the literature, no one really knows the details of that, but it doesn't matter. The reality is, Lance has done extraordinarily well in business. He built a company. He sold it for a lot of money and never has to work again,
[00:01:10] Dustin Serviss: but he does. And he has a interesting lifestyle and a a number of different philosophy on lifestyle focus, behaviors, and tips and tricks that he uses to keep him balanced in his life. And you get to learn about the next chapter that happened after Club Penguin, and, let's get after it. I am excited to have Lance Prieb on the podcast today, and, I've known Lance for a number of years. But, you know, something that's always inspired me is, is the active nature of, of hiking lifestyle. You have a great business background that, you know, I'm sure we'll touch on, but, you know, for for opening up the conversation,
[00:01:52] Dustin Serviss: help us understand where the name Hyper Hippo actually
[00:01:56] Lance Priebe: came from. Oh, oh my goodness. It was a joke. This is a straight out joke. My biggest career success in entertainment and video games is, Club Penguin. I founded that with Dave Crisco and Lane Merryfield. Of course, it's called Club Penguin. And then... But prior to that, my personal video game studio I started in nineteen ninety nine was called Rocket Snail. And, of course, the team, when we were trying to find up a name for our new studio, is just joking me and everything should be a animal adverb verb something rather. So they said we should be hyper hippo. I'm like, okay. Fine. That was it.
[00:02:39] Lance Priebe: The irony, of course, is we are known now in the industry as the leading developer of what's called an idle game. So the the name hyper and idle, it just... In the line.
[00:02:51] Dustin Serviss: So, the more, we chat and the more I chat with some of your your partners, the video game space always fascinates me, the scale, the, you know, the sheer use of it and how many millions of people, you know, use your games. But, I think we should unpack that for a sec. So an idle game is this isn't, this doesn't sound like car racing or, you know, the two dimensional, you know, angry birds being...
[00:03:17] Lance Priebe: That's an that's an industry word. So you as a consumer wouldn't hear that word.
[00:03:22] Dustin Serviss: Okay.
[00:03:24] Lance Priebe: That's just what we call it in the industry, and I think it's actually poorly named. I think it's becoming what's called a game mechanic. So such as you play chess, which would be a strategy game. You have an action or or what's called a field game. So that would be what you hear all your teenagers playing, like, Fortnite and running around blasting things.
[00:03:42] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:03:42] Lance Priebe: You have your simulators and aircrafts. You have you have your... What's called match three, which, millions and millions and millions player. That's your your candy crush and your match the three objects and puzzle puzzle games. And then you have idle games. And idle games came out as a... It's a style of gameplay where, you make a couple interesting choices, but the game plays by itself. And you put it away, and then you keep checking in on it to see how your progress is doing. So it's it's idling along while you're you're not playing it. And that's... It's very popular for the older gamers, that wish they still had
[00:04:19] Lance Priebe: time to play games, but they don't have any more time. We get a lot of fan mail, like, pilots of aircrafts, business... Lawyers, everybody. They're like, I'm so busy. I miss playing games, but I love your game because I feel like I'm playing it all the time. But they're not. Right. Sitting in their pocket idling away, and they check-in maybe, oh, our players sometimes check-in about four or five times per day to make interesting choices and then continue on with their lives. So I love it because it's not interrupt. We're not asking you to sit down for two, three hours, stare at a screen and play. That...
[00:04:53] Lance Priebe: That's the part I actually really, really like about
[00:04:55] Dustin Serviss: it. I think it's good for humanity. It's...
[00:04:57] Lance Priebe: I think it's great. But... And I think the superpower of games is what is a game, by the way. It... A game is just a series of interesting choices. That's actually what the definition is. And that's it. Versus spreading around like kids in chaos, on a field screaming at each other, which would probably be play. So there's play and then there's games. Games would be the rules of kids running around on a field doing something.
[00:05:23] Dustin Serviss: Man, it's well again. So, without getting into sort of the nitty gritty, but your your your hyper hippo serves, you know, people can look up the Club Penguin story, multiple media on that. But... So the Hyper Hippo story is is it one game or is it multiple games and you have a a user base that plays both or it's they only play one game?
[00:05:48] Lance Priebe: Some. So our we're a studio, so we produce... We have multiple teams creating multiple games. We have to keep trying to build more hits. Our most popular... Our oldest game and most popular is Adventure Capitalist. As a joke, we made a follow-up game called Adventure Communist. Okay. I'll be honest. It's harder to market, especially during an election in the US. That was... Facebook kept saying we're too political.
[00:06:14] Dustin Serviss: Okay....
[00:06:15] Lance Priebe: Saying, well, it's a game of... It... It's a potato simulator. If you ever wanna play it, if you can get over the name of it, it's a potato simulator. You grow potatoes.
[00:06:23] Dustin Serviss: Okay.
[00:06:25] Lance Priebe: And then we're working on a new one called Adventure Ages right now. It's just, like, going through time and time machine, and you deal with, like, Egyptians through dark ages, through space, through just different periods of time. And you're building empires. It's just an empire building game. So you're building your your empire.
[00:06:43] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:06:43] Lance Priebe: We're having fun. And we got other teams working on a couple more ideas. And then, yes, some... A lot of players don't play all of them, so that's why you make more than one. Because there's always so many people that wanna play a venture capitalist by itself is what's called a tycoon game, which is just, run a business. People are interested in running a business game. So it's a comedy. It makes fun of it. But not everybody wants to play that, so we make different ones. So the potato one is more of a farming game. You grow, etcetera. Ages is a little bit more of a building game, so buildings matter.
[00:07:20] Lance Priebe: So what cultural artifacts like, civilizations? What part of your culture will help your culture grow? You know, I want more music, therefore, my culture becomes more artistic or something. Yeah. We're just trying different ideas.
[00:07:33] Dustin Serviss: So, adventure capitalist is is... So the the leaders of that game, are they necessarily business leaders, or is it gameplay? Like, I I... I'm I'm always intrigued by that game because you... It's a start with a lemonade stand. Does it not? Yeah. Yeah. So you...
[00:07:51] Lance Priebe: That's what every entrepreneur should start with a lemonade. Then you start washing washing your neighbor's cars.
[00:07:57] Dustin Serviss: Is that is that actually what happens in the game? Yeah.
[00:07:59] Lance Priebe: Or no? As soon as you've made enough money building lemonades, you start your car washes. And as soon as you got your car washes, you... I think it's... You move on to pizza delivery and then donut making, and then we make fun of, and then we start making... A lot of people don't always catch the cultural jokes. So then we make fun of, Forrest Gump's, shrimp boat shrimp boats. You start a shrimp boat company. Then, of course, near the end of the game, of course, you... Well, we're Canadian, so you have to become an owner of a hockey team. And then, of course, you you wanna own a bank.
[00:08:33] Lance Priebe: Because if you own a bank, you own your own money, and then we just make fun.
[00:08:38] Dustin Serviss: Well, very, so then the the leaders of that game, are they business people or are they gamers? Like they're or they're, everybody. Game professional.
[00:08:46] Lance Priebe: You'd be amazed. We get letters from unbelievable. We got letters recently from, like, United States Marine Corps, deployed soldiers that say they're they're... They just love the activity to take their mind off of what they're doing right now.
[00:09:02] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:09:02] Lance Priebe: But they like that the game just progresses, and they can not have to put in hours of work. We got business leaders. We've got student elementary school classrooms that play it to teach. I have no idea what, but somehow the teachers are using it to teach compound interest or something.
[00:09:18] Dustin Serviss: Okay.
[00:09:19] Lance Priebe: But it's just funny and cute. And, everyone. Most people are shocked. Like, here in Canada, the average gamer is over thirty five years old in Canada, and it's fifty fifty. It's women and men. North America was actually the least... We did a disservice to all our poor women in in our nation's US and Canada because when video games came to North America, they came to the toy store. Rest of Europe and Asia actually just took video games as, like, a cultural entertainment device. So it was for everyone. Here in North America, we brought it to the toy store, and sadly, we put the video game machine in the boy aisle.
[00:10:00] Lance Priebe: So it made it predominantly male for many, many years. And now it's... We've caught up to the rest of the world where gaming is just play. Everybody loves play. It doesn't matter who you are. Yeah. So... And we're also the younger of ages. We were the the... We... It was in a toy store. Therefore, games were thought for kids. Internationally, games are for everyone. You just play, and you already do. You golf. You Yeah. Play sports. There's all the same thing.
[00:10:27] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. Activities,
[00:10:29] Lance Priebe: hobbies, things to do.
[00:10:30] Dustin Serviss: And and how how much time do do you game or do you game or is the outlet building it?
[00:10:35] Lance Priebe: Like, board games everywhere.
[00:10:37] Dustin Serviss: I see that. I see that.
[00:10:40] Lance Priebe: That's a tricky question for most people in the industry that if you talk to people in, like, Hollywood and stuff, the Hollywood people I know don't actually watch any movies. People that usually work in video games don't play any games.
[00:10:52] Dustin Serviss: Is it...
[00:10:53] Lance Priebe: We we begin to... You you analyze it. So you start playing it going, oh, I get it. Oh, I know what they did. Oh, I know what this does. Oh, I know this is what's gonna happen. And then you're like, this is kinda boring because I've already read. I've dissected it so many times that I know exactly what it's gonna do. So you start looking at other things and you have other hobbies. So I go hiking.
[00:11:16] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. Well, you're you're leading me into to the next sort of, you know, what I what I want to hear you talk about or what I think is is interesting is you are a very creative person. And you've been great at surrounding yourself with with different, people with different skill sets. But that creativity, you know, we talk pre show of those waves of creativity come and go, but you do have a very active lifestyle and you do have certain things that you're extremely passionate about that you don't, you don't maybe, maybe correct me if I'm wrong, but you don't work twelve hours a day, you know, seven days a week.
[00:11:52] Dustin Serviss: And I don't get the impression that, that in the early days, that was maybe correct me that that existed either. You always had this sort of creative juice and recognized the value of space and the value of being giving your self permission to go out and do some sort of activity that you're passionate about and ideas that then lead to money have popped into those places. So a lot of the listeners are our business owners and people who might be having trouble figuring out I could never take a Friday off because I gotta be in my business. So, you know, for you and and sort of the journey that you've had, how... Would...
[00:12:32] Dustin Serviss: Is that something you made yourself realize, or is that something you've always...
[00:12:37] Lance Priebe: No. I've I've had to make myself realize that you... You're painting a beautiful picture, but probably my twenties and thirties, no. I worked a lot. I worked every waking minute. We put in tons and tons and tons of hours. Even when we had small children, I actually loved that they had nap times and everything.
[00:12:58] Dustin Serviss: I was
[00:12:58] Lance Priebe: just working away in the room while they were sleeping.
[00:13:01] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:13:01] Lance Priebe: He, but it took me, it took me a long time to start catching in that that my health wasn't in the right place, and relationships and just open yourself up to opportunities. Like, I was really talented and skilled, knew what I wanted to build. And you're correct. The early on when I didn't know what idea I really wanted to work on, you explore ideas and you try different things. But when Penguin came along and early Hyper Hippo came along, it was all in and all working on it. Now now when I start a new company and start a new project though, and I've learned a lot more, I've learned that the other things are just as important.
[00:13:46] Lance Priebe: And I'm not saying, the trick isn't isn't that it's it's it's you you... I was saying preshow. You have... You're right. You have to create space for things to happen. Like, I actually do take more than Fridays off per week. My calendar is heavily blocked. My office hours for the team to actually book me is something like ten AM to three. And then, Tuesdays, I'm not available till one. Wednesdays, I'm not available. Thursdays, I'm avail... I think the date of the start of the t is available for team... Teams. And then, Fridays, I'm off. But I'm working because what happens is is upper... I need to create space in my business.
[00:14:37] Lance Priebe: If I kept showing up at the office every day, it was what I've learned. I just stay busy. But if I create space, my Wednesday is my my practice of, be... Get my create... My personal creative projects done. So that's when I'm managing my own teams and my own projects, my own deadlines. Every other day, I'm looking over other people's stuff, mentoring and checking in and stuff. And Fridays is my spillover day. So I'm not really taking it off. It's just if something happens. So, like like, I don't know. Like, if if... Well, I've had I've had it happen many times. So big studios like Netflix and Warner Brothers and all these guys
[00:15:17] Lance Priebe: give me a call on a Tuesday and say, we wanna talk to you. I'm like, great. I'm free Friday. Right. Because if you don't create that space, you cannot have any room for opportunity. And that's the big key there that I've really had to learn. So a lot of time... There's many weeks to go by. I'm like, oh, I got nothing to do this Friday. Well, I have a lot of... I I have a lot of things to keep me busy if I wanna just choose it. But I found that if I book my whole week, I can't get the big opportunities in. That's what I'm trying to say here.
[00:15:48] Dustin Serviss: And is there any tools that you really found? What I find when I'm on the coaching side and less than the financial planning is people, you know, they want everything to be perfect in line, to then take that day off. So Is... That's what I
[00:16:06] Lance Priebe: tell you.
[00:16:06] Dustin Serviss: It's like you never will be. And we just, you know, I I went with a client, a couple of Fridays ago and I rented a Harley. And he had a Harley who she'd never ridden for, like, two or three years. And I said, you gotta insure it by two weeks from now. I'm gonna rent a Harley. We're gonna go for two and a half hours in the morning on Friday. You know, you can see he was kind of like, like short circuiting. And after, you know, the smile on his face, I can't believe we're doing this on a Friday and sitting in his driveway, I just said it's never going to be perfect. Yes. There's probably twelve phone calls that happened during that time, but
[00:16:39] Dustin Serviss: did you just make that commitment before of of just kinda jumping off the cliff and and saying, I have to do it, or did... Was there tools or a book or something that you read that made you feel comfortable enough
[00:16:51] Lance Priebe: to draw
[00:16:51] Dustin Serviss: on the line?
[00:16:55] Lance Priebe: Good question. Interestingly, so I was... I I started called Penguin. It was actually called Penguin Chat before it was called Penguin. Club Penguin was a collaboration with Dave and Lane. But before that, I was working on a project, my own personal game studio, and I was working on this little chat world with penguins in it. What year was... And, nineteen ninety nine, two thousand. K. And before these books came out that I love, I referenced atomic habits. That's a fantastic book. There's a new book actually by Seth Godin, the practice or the hob habit, the practice or something, another great book
[00:17:34] Lance Priebe: for creative people that one specifically talks about creativity. The interesting thing when I look, I was getting really burned out in the middle there when all my projects and I was building companies and doing stuff and just work, work, work, work, or I totally agree. My schedule was completely full. People were booking it for me. Everything was just, it was just packed. But when I looked back and I was like, what made these big successes work? And when I was starting my own game studio, I purposely took Fridays off. I was a young twenty something. I took Fridays off. I didn't take it off.
[00:18:13] Lance Priebe: I just said I was gonna work a day job for four days. And then on my one day, I was gonna work on my game studio, my own video game studio. And Wednesday nights, I worked on my game studio and Saturday mornings. And when I read these books about habit and atomic habits, there's another book, great book about habits as well. The ancestral food process. Power Habit. Great one. I learned that I created space and a pattern that always got everything done. Right? And that's where I started learning later. I was like, oh, I gotta go back to that. If that's where my success came from, then I'll put it back in. So I... I'm very vigilant,
[00:18:54] Lance Priebe: every month to lock... Put huge blocks of time in my calendar just to block it, just absolute blocks. This is what I wanna try to accomplish. This is the day I'm skiing. This is the day I'm gonna do coaching. This is the mentoring. These are the lunches I wanna take. There's nothing booked. Absolutely nothing booked.
[00:19:13] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. I love it.
[00:19:15] Lance Priebe: But I block it off first. And then at the every... Almost every Saturday, Sunday, I go through my week ahead and I go, is that really what I wanna do now? And actually start locking in. So, like, this podcast, it... It's it... I have a block at this time to do podcast. It actually says in my calendar because I get asked by fans and game sites and stuff to do podcast. So I've said, well, I I wanna do this. I never have time to do it. So I put in an hour every week, and whenever I get a phone call and I'm like, yep. Next week, nobody's booked me yet. So podcasts are go. Yeah. And you just have to just carve them in.
[00:19:52] Lance Priebe: If it doesn't happen, then the what I get to hike more. There's always work.
[00:19:58] Dustin Serviss: Well, you, you leave each other.
[00:19:59] Lance Priebe: It never, ever will stop. Well,
[00:20:04] Dustin Serviss: yeah. And I'm, I'm just, you know, witnessing this kind of listening to you, you talk and I, and again, you have enough money to, to not work. So that that is, I don't know if that's natural. Like I think if, you know, when we do... When I'm working with, say, younger business owners and, you know, there's hard charging and, well, if I just open one more location, I'll just have way more money, and then I'll be happy.
[00:20:30] Lance Priebe: It's not a good money.
[00:20:32] Dustin Serviss: Well, so I want you to I want you to bust this up a sec because you have enough money to... Oh, wait.
[00:20:38] Lance Priebe: I had I had enough money when I started my game studio taking one day off a week of working Wednesday night. So So
[00:20:44] Dustin Serviss: the But
[00:20:45] Lance Priebe: I did... The honest truth, though, I didn't. We had a townhouse. We enjoyed it. We owned one car. We walked to work and happy as can be. Like, I was making video without a games. That's making video games. Yeah.
[00:20:58] Dustin Serviss: How much better can it get than that?
[00:21:00] Lance Priebe: How much better it could be? I remember two years into it. It was around two thousand two or so. I came back to Dave, my boss at that time. He became my partner at Club Penguin. And I remember telling him, I'm like, Dave, I need to take two days off a week. I'll work for you for three days. You pay me a paycheck, and I'm gonna take two days to work on my game student. And he's like, why are you gonna do that? And I said, well, I'm a one day off on Fridays. I make more money annually than you pay me for my four days. So I said it's time to... I said I wanna grow my business. So I said it's time to get now to two days off a week.
[00:21:34] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. And that... So you you set the intention and and and made it happen. But coming back to the blocking, so you still have a driving passion to be active. Is is it a drive to still use your brain, or is there a fear of something if you didn't, you know, work on the business or a passion projects? Like, how come if if you've got enough money, why don't you just travel and buy a yacht?
[00:21:58] Lance Priebe: And that's boring. Yeah. Well, I, the most exciting thing I can do in my career right now, I do that anyway. I go hiking and everything with it. Most exciting thing I can do right now. I love to create things. I love watching creative people create things. The best thing I can do is... Well, I tell people, like, I believe the number one gift of an entrepreneur is to actually create jobs, not wealth.
[00:22:21] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:22:22] Lance Priebe: Create jobs. I love... I have it on my wall that I have three goals. One is to create, two thousand jobs for the creative industry employed all at the same time. I want to delight and inspire one billion fans, and I wanna do it entirely from my backpack hiking the world. That's on my wall. What else would you wanna do? It's awesome.
[00:22:53] Dustin Serviss: Well, it definitely shows the scope of your mind and how, people get
[00:22:57] Lance Priebe: We're halfway to a billion. I'm, like, almost there. Like, rock and roll. There are three hundred and fifty million kids play club hang when they're still fans. We've added another hundred and something million fans over venture capitalists and stuff on March. My way to a billion fans.
[00:23:11] Dustin Serviss: So Yeah. So so when you get there, you know, and
[00:23:16] Lance Priebe: also I'm gonna have to double the numbers, I guess. I just have to pick a target.
[00:23:21] Dustin Serviss: I'll ask you a different...
[00:23:22] Lance Priebe: You need to set goals. I'm like, these goals suck. I just wanna do it.
[00:23:26] Dustin Serviss: Well, I I think what we realized, well, what I realized that I'm the more people that are on the show that I I listened to it isn't so much the goals are like a checklist. It's the values behind them and the value your value is, you know, impacting a number of people and making, you know, sir... You know, not serving so much, but you do that. But just the creation out of nothing to something. And, I do find that quite inspiring. So back me up to Lance, twenty years ago.
[00:23:58] Lance Priebe: Oh, dear.
[00:23:58] Dustin Serviss: That's that's enough.
[00:24:00] Lance Priebe: Like I was a
[00:24:01] Dustin Serviss: punk. Well, so what what twenty years ago would you have bought or done different or experienced that you didn't because you didn't know your financial picture now knowing where you would be today?
[00:24:17] Lance Priebe: Well, I was blessed. So I'm a son of a banker. So my dad always taught me about how to save, invest, RSPs, put aside. I did monthly check... Weekly, everything. I knew exact. We we knew every year we couldn't account for less... About two hundred dollars We didn't know what we spent it on. That's how well we were still in our twenties and stuff. So it's really important to measure. If you don't have the money and you can't save it, you should still measure it. It's usually quite shocking, and that changed a lot of behavior. Mhmm. So, like, we sold our extra car, all that stuff, and just bought a
[00:24:55] Lance Priebe: townhouse closer to both our works so we can both walk. And that's the cost... We just... Because we knew the annual cost savings. And we're like, well, that's gonna make us really rich. We can go travel, like, Hawaiian stuff because that's that's what it's worth. Owning a second car, insuring it, gassing it, driving, commuting, all that. It's like, that's a Hawaii trip.
[00:25:16] Dustin Serviss: Yeah.
[00:25:17] Lance Priebe: For a young couple. What would I change? More around the failure side. Like, I'm getting a lot better. I'm not the greatest at... I would... So in our industry, you gotta learn when to kill a project and walk away. I would stay too long with any project or business or anything. We have to just keep chopping and moving. Video games is interesting because at the end of the day, we have no asset. Okay? So if the game doesn't work, there's nothing. I have no property. I don't own a building. There's no store. There's no... It's zero. It's literally a zero dollar. Right? You got a debt, and that's it. There's nothing you can even sell.
[00:26:12] Lance Priebe: And people need to understand that scope. And I've tried to coach some investors that wanna get into gaming, and then they really freak out because they realize that there's actually no asset. So you have to in the entertainment industry. Same with a movie, a film. There's no asset. If the film doesn't work or you don't finish it, there's nothing. You owe nothing. You just spent money. And the... This terrifying part is there's no break even. It has to be a hit. You can't aim for the middle. You have to go for the top. You need to aim for the top one hundred top ten charts or you cannot succeed.
[00:26:50] Lance Priebe: You have to work in multipliers, not a percentage. There's no... Like, if my team sometimes comes back with, well, this will give us a five percent increase. I'm like, well, those will shut the studio down and walk away. Because who cares? I said, if it's not ten x, we can't risk it. But we have to be that bold. Younger me wasn't that bold. I thought the I thought the missus would hurt me more, and I've now learned they don't. They actually make you get even more work because most of the industry just wants to see what you do after you fail in a gaming project and and just get up and make another one.
[00:27:30] Lance Priebe: And then people just start showing up and saying, well, we'll publish your second one, third one, fourth one, fifth one because you've shown that you can just do it. What they're afraid of is that you'll hold on and blow all their money and that it has no win because you didn't you didn't go to the mark... For us, we have to go to the market. Go to the market really early, get data. Like, is this... Does anyone care? Does anybody even play... We think people think it's fun that... Who cares? That's enough. Doesn't matter.
[00:27:59] Dustin Serviss: What are the facts?
[00:28:00] Lance Priebe: Audience care. Can we generate an income or something from an audience? Does it actually have any traction out there? And, we need to get to that so fast, but so many developers I watched drag that on for years. And that's just too dangerous in the entertainment market because there's no... It's just money. It's just gone. There there is absolutely nothing. Expensive computers in a beautiful lease building with no asset.
[00:28:26] Dustin Serviss: A bunch of sets of good headphones. So what, like, what makes a good investment? Because I know that, you know, if people are looking at stocks or certain things, but a lot of people's wealth has been generated by buying private business, either starting themselves or investing in it. So.
[00:28:47] Lance Priebe: I failed at all those. I tried some of those. I don't do any of them anymore. Looked at developments and buildings and junk. I suck. Yeah. I've got... I get so many people knock on my door. Who do you wanna help me with such and such? I don't do anything physical.
[00:29:00] Dustin Serviss: I can imagine the door... The the knocking of the door. But, you know, you call it a wealth edge. So your wealth edge is vetting maybe high return opportunities or zero. And that's a that's a fascinating space, to be in because it's not what's marketed, you know, by the big investment and the big banks. You know, these, you know, buy boring, conservative, diversify.
[00:29:23] Lance Priebe: I'm actually super conservative. When I get a win, I put my money into the simplest and safest stuff ever. If I can get a three, four, five percent return per year, it's rock and roll. That's... I'm happy. Three, I'm even happy. Okay? Because on my other hand, I'm taking the highest possible risk. So when we build a video game, we're looking at... It it is literally a roulette roll of millions of dollars we spent to try and then get to make nothing. Like, it's not it's not even, like, ten bucks or... Like, this is not even, like, half. It's like, oh, here's the bill. Move on. Build another one. What do I invest? What do I look for?
[00:30:10] Lance Priebe: I've actually been asked that a couple times already. I'm looking for the people, the the... What I call champions in entertainment and stuff who who would die on their project. Like, not die, but, like, they fight for it. They're not gonna bend because somebody else says, you know, we should do this. You should do that. You should do this. Whatever. They're gonna be like, no. No. This is it. This is the heart of it. And they wanna drive it through. So I'm looking for those champions that really wanna lead it through. And then I'm gonna rein back their ideas a lot and go, well,
[00:30:40] Lance Priebe: if you've studied like lean startup or minimum viable products or anything like that, I'm like, so what do we take to the market to find out? Does it have momentum? And then I'm always investing on momentum. I wanna see momentum daily to weekly. If I can't see momentum, then I don't wanna invest in the project. We have to show momentum. And then in entertainment, if you wanna know the magic formula, the actual currency you're trading on is what's called attention. Do you have people's attention? If you do, that converts money. If you don't, well, then you got nothing. Because the reality is is everyone maybe only has...
[00:31:16] Lance Priebe: I'm gonna be generous here. Maybe six hours to spend on entertainment. So that'd be Netflix or whatever.
[00:31:22] Dustin Serviss: A day, a week, a month?
[00:31:24] Lance Priebe: I'm gonna say a day. I'm just picking a number of the hat. I don't actually have to research on what people consume on attention. So I'm talking scrolling your Instagram, watching TikTok, playing a video game, watching Netflix, getting a series, doing YouTube, etcetera. What is your... You're listening to your podcast? What is your your six hours per day? And if you're in entertainment and you can't own a piece of that six hours, you will never convert to money.
[00:31:50] Dustin Serviss: Mhmm.
[00:31:50] Lance Priebe: So what I'm trying to measure against is how much of that time we start to take away. When I see a project in a game and I'm watching the numbers on it and I'm seeing that... Well, like a venture capitalist, most diehard players play two to three minutes, five times per day, every day for years. So I own attention right there.
[00:32:15] Dustin Serviss: Mhmm.
[00:32:16] Lance Priebe: I can make money off of attention.
[00:32:18] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:32:19] Lance Priebe: Whatever way possible. Means I could sell an ad. I can just ask you for money. Hey. It was, you know, cheaper than a Starbucks coffee. You wanna pay us? You know, that kind of thing. Yeah. I have a I have a value statement to that point because I have your attention.
[00:32:37] Dustin Serviss: Well, I know I know you kinda chuckled, but it... Because it seems it's it's the world you live in. But I... You know, again, for most people, it's it's a fascinating world of, you know, the the ask for money. Everyone kinda knows the ads. But in in a game, is there certain kind of revenue streams that are better than others or cost less? Or is it pretty much the same because the game is running? So whether it's an ad or an upgrading of a sword or whatever.
[00:33:05] Lance Priebe: It's it's, there's a lot of science. The, you're doing what's called player motivations, exchanging player motivations against what they value for their attention. So, let's say you're a collector. Your your motivator is a collection, like collecting, Pokemon Go, for example, all that people playing Pokemon. Collect all the Pokemon. I would design a game that shows you that there's a hundred things to collect. You've got ten of them. You've got ninety to go. You're grinding away. It's gonna take you twenty minutes to get each item. Eventually, either I can put a pressure point that I...
[00:33:51] Lance Priebe: You will create in your mind value that for me to complete the collection, it's worth buying it, playing it, spending time against it, or watching ads for it. So I'm gonna find a value trade for you to complete a collection. It's no different than watching you go, like, to a cabin and watch people. Why on the earth do people have a hobby of building puzzles? But, let's take a beautiful picture and break it. So there's a large group of people that are obsessed. You have to think of the value statement here. I will pay... This person pays twenty dollars for a box of cardboard with a photo on
[00:34:27] Lance Priebe: it that's now broken, and they're spending time, their attention, to rebuild it. That's a game mechanic. So we just look at your motivators. Let's say you're, you're probably in business and stuff. You might be in what's called an achiever. You have to win. So what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna put you in a racing game, a sports game. I'm gonna put you in competition. I'm gonna show you the leaderboard. I'm gonna show you where you stand, how you're performing, what's your stats against your competition. And I'm gonna drive you to always wanna win. And then I'm gonna feed your motivation, which is achievement, If
[00:34:59] Lance Priebe: that's what you are, if you're a socializer, like, don't let the group down. Don't... Whatever. It has nothing new with the game. Those people are like, you heard of Clash of Clans? Yep. Yep. Clash of Clans is best money making at socializer. They make a lot of their money from the player that's the worst player. So they get you into a clan. You join a group. Underperforming members of the group don't wanna leave the high performing players of the group behind, so they pay money to catch up.
[00:35:27] Dustin Serviss: It's pretty simple to me.
[00:35:29] Lance Priebe: Because they don't wanna let their group down.
[00:35:31] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:35:32] Lance Priebe: They don't feel bad. Everybody's happy. Like, I get some people say, well, this video game stuff money charging's bad. I'm like, fine. Go to any golf course, buy a Titleist v one and figure out what the cost difference between that and the Kirkland ball is. Reality is... Sorry, guys. We're all not Tiger Woods, and we're not gonna actually see a difference between a v one and a Kirkland. Yeah. So, you know, as well as I do because I call, you know, the v one is far superior. So...
[00:35:57] Dustin Serviss: Of course, it's the field. It's the field. It's when you tee it up and you look at it.
[00:36:01] Lance Priebe: But how much money are we dropping?
[00:36:03] Dustin Serviss: Oh, yeah. I know. But there's a... It's back your value. You value the ball.
[00:36:08] Lance Priebe: Back the value. So you got all these teenagers in Call of Duty, making sure they they have to rig out their guy.
[00:36:18] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:36:18] Lance Priebe: They're allowed basic gear for free or they can go buy the luxurious whatever v one golf ball and rig out and load out their guy. And that's how the video game industry makes money. We just look at your motivators, what drives you and offer you the... We trade the value for it, but that's business.
[00:36:38] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. Well, I, I'll, I'll let you park the the current business that I'll I'll skip over the previous business. But the one question I did, you know, I've known you for a number of years and when I look online and, you know, if people look up your name, there seems to be a real, common, this, this penguin story, but, you know, behind all that, that it's the same narrative, whether it's whatever paper, what, what is something about Lance pre that most people don't know, you know, that the media doesn't say about your, your business or your, you know, your, your work life balance,
[00:37:19] Dustin Serviss: or, you know, the, the things that you're, you're passionate about currently or in the past?
[00:37:26] Lance Priebe: Well, I'm a really, really private guy. I I don't post anything about my family or anything I'm doing, like, personally. Just show, like, basically, like, you know, it just shows that I'm hiking out doing stuff, business leading and running companies and projects. I get excited about all the projects. Yes. But I'm not sure much the private side. Love my kids deeply. Really trying to help them. And now as they're older teenagers and stuff to get them into their... Where their passions and their careers are, whatever it be. Something about me that most people don't know, I'm actually quite quirky.
[00:38:05] Lance Priebe: I used to collect my first company when I was eight was making my own comic books and printing them and selling them at school.
[00:38:12] Dustin Serviss: What was the first version? What was the... I don't even remember.
[00:38:15] Lance Priebe: It was like some weird frog superhero thing. I don't know. I drew it, wrote it, directed it, went to my dad. And my dad was like a workaholic. According to my younger brother, my dad was a workaholic. I never knew. I just, like... He was like, I need to go to work. I was like, great. Can I go with you? Because I'm gonna use the photocopier. And then I would print my comic book series and then sell them. So I guess I've always been doing entertainment stuff. The the... I don't know. I love getting out nature. Love the hikes. Hiking and walking is really my quiet time.
[00:38:52] Dustin Serviss: Well, that's... Again, I was, more more tapping into your, your creative side. And, you know, you've got, you know, just such a an interesting brain. And, you know, has has that ever got you in trouble?
[00:39:11] Lance Priebe: It
[00:39:11] Dustin Serviss: has it.
[00:39:15] Lance Priebe: All the time. I'm always coming up with dumb ideas that people are like, what the hell? Like,
[00:39:21] Dustin Serviss: what's the... How do you how do you take that? Or how do you lead? You know, is the is the team you've you've led and and you've had a lot of them for a number of years. Do they ever... The longer way they always see us?...
[00:39:31] Lance Priebe: Begin to know. They ignore me more as they've with me longer, but, they know that there's so many ideas that I'm fully aware both... Almost all of them are gonna fail, but you gotta get them out there. You gotta let them live, breathe, run around, and then go, oh, that... Yeah. That was a dumb idea. Oh, back to your question, like younger self. I wish I would have been more disciplined because I would come up with an idea and I chase it. Now I actually... I I note take everything I've got. I take a lot of notes, and, I just write down an idea. And I always put a date next to it to review again in thirty days.
[00:40:06] Lance Priebe: So if I'm still excited, then I go for it. But back then, no. I was just like, if there was a there was a cat with a laser, who's the beam on the floor, I chased it.
[00:40:19] Dustin Serviss: But it... Well, well...
[00:40:20] Lance Priebe: Now now I've learned that there's actually...... People like to be ideas. Yeah. But there's... I've learned that there's actually costs and things around my ideas, and I'm like, I should actually just pause for a minute. Because the thing is is usually another idea comes and it's better. So then I get into trouble because a lot of people are like, but you just told us last week, this great idea, and we're working on it. Now you want us to do this new thing? And I'm like, yeah. The new thing's better. So this is why I've been... I've been learning now to wait thirty days and go, am I still excited about it?
[00:40:50] Dustin Serviss: Right. Well, so if you you are, again, you you you nailed it already. I didn't have to say it, but a low key person and, I, you know, from what I know and what you've told me and what I've seen, you're not a very flashy person. Although you, you run-in a circle of wealth with lots of other flashy people, but what is... You know, if you think of the five wealthiest people you know, that are... Or your your... In your friend group that would be of your wealth or or greater, are they the same people that you think would be the five richest people you know? Or are there different traits between, you know, or, you know, ultimately,
[00:41:33] Dustin Serviss: I'm trying to get at what is your definition or the ultimate picture of wealth?
[00:41:39] Lance Priebe: Financially, I don't have that many super wealthy friends. My definition of wealth, it's just the the happy person that loves their career job. And they're just, they're just being there. They're so exciting to be around. But those are my favorite people. I'm usually hanging around with those people. They're just... We just hang out, go for coffee, grab stuff. It's super cool. It's just... They're just content, happy. That's it.
[00:42:08] Dustin Serviss: It it... So for the person who's not there, for the person who's still kinda stuck on that treadmill of, you know, I just just gotta get more money, just gotta, you know, keep charging. Is there any any last things you can kind of...
[00:42:23] Lance Priebe: Well, I was surprised really early on that money is only a magnifying glass. That's all it is. That's it.
[00:42:30] Dustin Serviss: What do you mean by that?
[00:42:33] Lance Priebe: Whatever your personal behavior or passions are today, right now, if you if you were seeking... If you're a micromanager or anything, all money's gonna do is magnify it. So you will become worse or better. If you're already very charitable, you're gonna be more charitable. If you're already tight and controlling, you're just gonna become more tight and controlling. If you're already unhappy, you're just going to be actually more unhappy. You're already happy. You're just gonna be more happy. I don't actually believe it does anything other than magnify what you already are. So that's it. I just, I just love creating things and making jobs.
[00:43:23] Lance Priebe: I just now get to make more jobs and create more things. Mhmm.
[00:43:27] Dustin Serviss: You have, you know, a quote. So the... Your quote is peace with the past, curious for the future, and enjoying the moment.
[00:43:36] Lance Priebe: Yes. That's what I'm trying to live by, trying to get into. I'm not always perfect with it. Sometimes I dwell on the past a little too long, but I'm trying to, like, just be a piece of the past, and then just love today because it's just so cool. We can't we can't buy this time. That's why I love idle games too. You can't buy time.
[00:43:55] Dustin Serviss: Mhmm. Right. And so is there, is there places that have created that, that mantra and enjoy the moment is, you know, you, you have to plan for the future and you have to be strategic in your day to day life. You know? Yeah. You... So That's true. How how do you try to maximize the the here and the now when you live... You have to live out in the future when you're designing games and and predicting things?
[00:44:27] Lance Priebe: Probably don't understand the question well enough.
[00:44:30] Dustin Serviss: Well, you know, you you find... If, you know, enjoying the moment, have you not enjoyed it before, or have you lived, you know, really out your goals or aspirations too much?
[00:44:40] Lance Priebe: I've lived portion of my life just dwelling on the past. I've lived in a portion of my life thinking too far in the future and ignoring everything around me in the present. Later couple years now, I'm just really trying to focus on the present because I'm finding that that's actually where I get to get things done.
[00:44:55] Dustin Serviss: Because you turned forty recently?
[00:44:57] Lance Priebe: Oh, I'm getting closer to the fifty side, actually.
[00:45:02] Dustin Serviss: Turn forty I'm off to forty this year, so that's why I'm saying forty.
[00:45:05] Lance Priebe: I turned forty a long time ago.
[00:45:07] Dustin Serviss: Oh, yeah.
[00:45:07] Lance Priebe: That... That's where the press was actually funny. They always said whatever us three twenty somethings. Dave always laughed. He was, like, fifty something when they said that. And I was, like, late thirties and Lane was, like, twenty something. I was like, oh, I'm twenty something. Cool.
[00:45:21] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. Well, yes. It's tech. It's tech space is always younger, I guess, or maybe that's what they think.
[00:45:29] Lance Priebe: Yeah. It's a journey. I don't have it solved. All I know is it's... I saw somewhere about, like, you can't build it. You can't have a time machine to go back in time, but you can look to the future because you can go into the future or something like that was an interesting quote like that. It was like, you always get to go into the future versus you can't go into the past.
[00:45:51] Dustin Serviss: So,
[00:45:52] Lance Priebe: you're just building what you have right now. Like, a lot of the young designers and stuff, a couple of, you know, entrepreneurs I work with, they were building up, trying to make a bunch of money, doing whatever, and I've coached them. And their companies failed, and they did whatever, and they're all down. And I'm like, guys, you learned, I'm teaching my teenagers right now. I said, you're you're before you turn thirty. I said, now's the time you get to just invest in you. Get all your skills, get all your talent, know that if it was all taken away, you just do it again. Like, don't worry about it. Get those skills, get those things.
[00:46:26] Lance Priebe: Cause at, you know, twenty five, twenty four, twenty eight, twenty, whatever you are, Own up grandma and grandpa, aunts and uncles wherever you can live on a couch for a month. It won't hurt you.
[00:46:37] Dustin Serviss: Yeah.
[00:46:37] Lance Priebe: But get those skills. And then as you get into thirties and forties, now you gotta start locking in. You're like, well, this is what I'm doing, etcetera like that. I was thinking about the... Actually, that question the other day. I was like, what if you take a bet one day and lose it? I'm like, okay. I have enough friends that would probably give me a free laptop, and I bet it would take six months and I can do it again. So I'm like, whatever. Yeah. I've got the network. I've got the skill. I've got the ability. I've got the knowledge. I can just build it. So
[00:47:07] Dustin Serviss: I think Tim Ferris says that about, when he looks at venture investing. It it... He says, am I gonna meet new people that could help me in my bigger purpose in the future? And am I gonna learn something that's also gonna fit with some other bigger projects? And if it doesn't start with those two things, because he says, if I lose all my money but I still got new connections and I got new learning that's gonna help my bigger, you know, driving force, then he... He's, you know, it's on the next round of his mental due diligence.
[00:47:37] Lance Priebe: Yeah. But, no, that's that's about it. Like, you can lose it tomorrow, but I'm fully confident I can just do it again. And I have a blast doing it again. That's the best part.
[00:47:48] Dustin Serviss: The best part. And that has nothing to do with an end goal that has to do with being around right now.
[00:47:53] Lance Priebe: It just happened to be an industry that performs financially pretty well. That's all. But, like, I'm coaching my kids. Like, you might pick an industry that doesn't perform all that great. Well, then be happy with it. One of my greatest stories that I try to introduce my kids to cool guys, This guy was a developer in New York, and he ran apartments and stuff. And he's my dive instructor in Hawaii.
[00:48:17] Dustin Serviss: Happiest guy
[00:48:18] Lance Priebe: in the world. He's like, I hate... He said he hated the grind. Daily grind, dealing with apartments, buildings. He owns it. He owns, like, a massive tower. He does all this stuff, has the cash, has whatever. It's all equal out. Right? The cost to operate it, it's a cost rent, whatever. And at least in the end, he'll make money. He said he hated the grind, hired that all out. He's in Hawaii. He's a dive instructor. He's... He... All he said was, I live in my van. I wake up every morning. My air tanks are always full, and I get to dive with interesting people every single day.
[00:48:49] Dustin Serviss: Pretty simple. And he don't need to sort of, if he can keep his health up, you know, which is, is important, then he could work for a long time. Yeah.
[00:48:58] Lance Priebe: Sure. He's got a big nest egg back in New York and he's got some comfort and everything there, but he said he wasn't having life. Mhmm. That's all. So he outsourced it all, which was... Which comes out as a wash. You're you're not getting a real profit. There's too many middle people. Right? But he could have grinded and made the difference. But then he said it wouldn't have every day, get my tanks filled, diving in every... Diving every day. Right.
[00:49:22] Dustin Serviss: And then, you know, just to close off the thought about the kids, you have three children. I do have a couple of children. So you're always trying to think of what kind of key, principles to, to teach them, but anything else that you're, you know, again, your kids are almost... Or they're almost out of high school or some of them are. Any core principles around business and life that that you keep reminding them?
[00:49:46] Lance Priebe: Oh, it's just be curious. That's it. That curiosity is gonna get you somewhere. I don't care what it is. There's so many people say get an education, get whatever. I I I go back to the root of it. Just be curious. So if you're curious about, like, health care, then, okay, that's gonna drive... That's gonna be your drive to get through school to become a doctor or something. But that curiosity is what you gotta see that thing. So I tell them try things. Experiment with things. Learn about things. Be curious because that's going to be your only thing that pushes you through to whatever it is. And then whatever they end up being, I don't know.
[00:50:22] Lance Priebe: One of them wants to be a rally car racer. I'm like, okay. Let's start ripping apart a car. Like... Right. Yeah.
[00:50:31] Dustin Serviss: Well, that's... Yeah. I hope I hope that that's that would be cool.
[00:50:35] Lance Priebe: That would be cool.
[00:50:37] Dustin Serviss: Yeah.
[00:50:38] Lance Priebe: He's got a ways to go from here to there. So we'll see.
[00:50:42] Dustin Serviss: Right. And your health program is, again, for people in the pod, you can't see, obviously we're on zoom. You still maintained pretty fit. Yeah. You hike it quite a bit, but is that the only thing you do for mental and physical health?
[00:50:57] Lance Priebe: Hike ski, and I go to the gym, so I got a good fitness coach for the muscle side. That was something new in the last about year and a half, two years. Because I was trying to lose there a little bit more weight and get some aches and pains out.
[00:51:09] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. And
[00:51:09] Lance Priebe: I and I went in and then one big... Another big business lesson I learned was, success actually comes from watching your blind spots. You can only do that by partnering well. That's a different talk. But you do not... You will never be successful if you can't watch your blind spots. And that's why you also don't partner with people you like. Lane, Dave, and myself are very different, but we saw all three hundred and sixty degrees around us.
[00:51:35] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:51:36] Lance Priebe: The... So I went to the gym coach. That was why I went to the gym coach. I point blank told the coach. I said, I hike. I'm active. I ski. I ski tour. I climb mountains. I do all sorts of things. And I'm like, I'm not getting where I wanna get to. So I'm... That means the only thing I learned in business, that means I'm missing something. I can't see something. Tell me what I can't see. So she started coaching me and started spotting where I'm not paying any attention to. So there's certain things in my diet, certain workouts, certain things that she's tuning that I've never done ever. Cause I even joke in the session.
[00:52:12] Lance Priebe: Like, what do I even need that muscle for? Right?
[00:52:16] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. Well, she's showing you.
[00:52:18] Lance Priebe: And, it's creating even better health, better knees, better strength, better distance, better hiking, everything already. So, but that's another day, another lesson. Great session on blind spots.
[00:52:32] Dustin Serviss: I will take you up on that. The, the, the, the, the final thing as a marketing guy. So as much as you're a creative guy, you are a marketing guy and you understand, that's where
[00:52:40] Lance Priebe: I started my career.
[00:52:41] Dustin Serviss: I know. So in all the supplements and all the different things, is there any sort of supplements you use or is it... Are you have you fallen victim to any of that stuff or are you just trying to do everything au natural, veggie, farmer's market, etcetera, etcetera?
[00:53:02] Lance Priebe: Across the board, the truth, I wanna move... I'm moving towards, eating things that are just as close to its natural state as possible. So you wanna treat, eat an apple. But, you know, I'll be frank and honest here. If if if there's a nice certain type of chocolate bar manufacturer that puts it on my desk, I will eat it. So
[00:53:26] Dustin Serviss: Well, I I don't even know where that question came from, but I just think of, like, you you like, you know, the surrounding yourself. You like, you know, reaching out and,
[00:53:36] Lance Priebe: I'm going with, I guess I'm going with the the camp of trying to get to just clean fuel. So Yeah. I love my steak. I love my whatever. Try to do... I wanna do less processing, but the reality is I eat too many protein bars and that's just processed and, you know, we'll get there.
[00:53:53] Dustin Serviss: So here's a... Here's just... I'll... This will be the last question. I promise. My wife and I have an ongoing debate about processed food. So, you know, I eat Lara bars and RX bars. So I'm just lazy. Well, they're dates, cashews, an egg white powder, and, say a chocolate chip. So it's like four or six ingredients, but nothing, you know, no big long words or the thing. And so my stance is that it's not processed. So the mechanics to make the bar is processed. But when I think of the word processed, I think of, like, chemicals and, like, deep, you know, things to keep it on the shelf. So what's your definition of processed food?
[00:54:35] Lance Priebe: My definition, I like what you're saying because it has the real real stuff in it. And, like, I don't worry about the long words because reality is a lot of the long words are actually things we're supposed to eat. The process in my mind is, like, getting closer to junk. So sorry. McDonald's, you're not serving the best thing. Yeah.
[00:55:01] Dustin Serviss: That we will save that for another podcast. And,
[00:55:03] Lance Priebe: Probably closer to... I I basically just look if it has sugars and stuff ongoing. It's processed. But Yeah. It's whipped up, canned, and chopped into a bar for convenience. I'm pretty good with it.
[00:55:18] Dustin Serviss: Well, I... My stance is touch stainless steel, food grade metal to get it mechanically into the size of it is, but it's not been chemically modified. I'll say that. But...
[00:55:27] Lance Priebe: Yeah. That's what I'm... I'm worried about a food that just isn't a food that gets closer to, like, you know, like a weakness for jupe jupe, you know, the liquor black jupe, which in reality is just liquid gasoline. But anyhow,
[00:55:42] Dustin Serviss: yeah. Okay.
[00:55:43] Lance Priebe: Well, that would be the answer.
[00:55:46] Dustin Serviss: I agree. I think my wife would agree with that too. So thanks a lot, lads. I, I definitely learned a few things that I didn't know, and I'm sure that, you know, there's some definite nuggets about balance, happiness, and business. So I really appreciate you on the podcast today and definitely lots of places we could go in the future. So thanks a lot for being on the picture of wealth.
[00:56:08] Lance Priebe: Thank you.
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