Living a FULL life with Dr. Rex Hawthorne (#35) — Transcript
Updated: Oct 26
THE PICTURE OF WEALTH · EPISODE 35
Dustin Serviss speaks with Dr. Rex Hawthorne about running a dental practice while pursuing sport and family life. They explore wakeboarding, personal challenges and what it takes to make room for a full life.
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This transcript was generated from the episode audio and lightly edited for readability. It may contain transcription or speaker-attribution errors. Refer to the recording for exact wording.
Chapters
[00:00:23] Introducing Dr. Rex Hawthorne
[00:03:03] Adaptive wakeboarding after a spinal injury
[00:08:26] Trying foil boarding
[00:09:59] Preparing for an adaptive ski trip
[00:12:55] Running a dental practice
[00:18:55] Learning from family and upbringing
[00:24:04] Reducing hours without giving up ambition
[00:29:51] Goals, values and relationships
[00:32:25] What a long-running happiness study suggests
[00:39:42] Rex’s picture of wealth
Guest & resources
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Transcript
[00:00:01] Show announcer: Welcome to The Picture of Wealth, a podcast all about living more of your life now yet being responsible for your future. Lifestyle experimenter, wealth scientist, and financial coach, Dustin Service, shares life hacks, wealth tips, and interviews successful entrepreneurs on how they're thriving in happiness, purpose, and prosperity.
[00:00:23] Dustin Serviss: I'm excited to have doctor Rex Hawthorne on the podcast today to talk about lifestyle, wakeboarding, skiing, biking, all of the above, and, also what it takes to run a successful dental practice. Thanks a lot for being on the show today, Rex.
[00:00:38] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Hey. My pleasure, Dustin.
[00:00:40] Dustin Serviss: So in, in doing a little prep for, just sort of warming up into the conversation, you, you went to the world championships for wakeboarding. Did you not?
[00:00:52] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: I did.
[00:00:52] Dustin Serviss: Okay. And you were how old when you went there?
[00:00:57] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Oh, let's go with, say, I think I was forty nine, forty nine or fifty, somewhere in there.
[00:01:03] Dustin Serviss: Okay. So that, obviously, you know, I... I've known you for a long time. I really respect what you've done and, knowing sort of roughly what I thought your age would have been, I was very, very inspired at, you know, what... When you're running a successful dental practice for kids, you've got lots of work life balance stuff happening. How did that thought come about to actually get into wakeboarding, let alone go, you know, world championship level?
[00:01:37] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: That's a good question. To be honest, it wasn't actually planned. I've I've always enjoyed water sports. I grew up, in Vernon, and, I had a dad that was very much into, water skiing and whatnot. So, we started at a young age, and it's something that my brother... My dad and I kinda did as a family. And, you know, looking back, certainly some fond memories, lots of time spent with dad and my brother on the lake. And it's something I I I did with my family when my my older kids were younger and my sort of second set of kids, if you will. We we still spend a lot of time on the lake. My son, really enjoyed wakeboarding and whatnot. And,
[00:02:20] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: you know, as sort of time went on, he started to compete. He was on the BCT team, and, worlds were held in Toronto, a number of years ago, and and he had an opportunity. He got to a level where he could participate. And, it really wasn't even a a thought on my radar. I mean, I enjoyed, I enjoyed wakeboarding and, you know, spending time with the family as as such. And my son just, he qualified and made it to worlds. And he said, hey, dad. Well, why don't you go? And I said, well, I haven't qualified. I haven't done anything. And he said, well, dad, I sent a video in, and, then they qualified you. And, maybe just to step back a little bit.
[00:03:03] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: As you know, Dustin, but probably your listeners don't, I was involved in a rather serious mountain biking accident in two thousand five, and I broke my back. So I live in a wheelchair. I have spinal cord injury. So, my son sent a video interview wakeboarding, as I do in a... What I refer to as a bucket. I have an adaptive seat that I put on my wakeboard. And, so when they saw that, they, I gather... They said my son and you go back and said, yep. You're gonna have to compete.
[00:03:29] Dustin Serviss: So I did. Wow.
[00:03:31] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: So it really wasn't, something that I had planned on doing, trained to do. I just... I... We've bought a lot with the family and, away I went. So...
[00:03:40] Dustin Serviss: But you still go... Do you go south or not? Not right now, maybe, but you still go south and try and put get in a little winter wakeboard, here or there or no? Is that... Am I forgetting that?
[00:03:53] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: No. I have wake boarded, you know, in Mexico and whatnot on trips, but it's not really... It's just something we did when we were there for fun, but it's not something I typically... I do. I've taken my son down to California a number of times for, camps, cable parks and whatnot. Yeah, I do that. And I used to do a lot of kiteboarding down in South Padre Island in Texas. So that was more of the thing I used to do. Yeah. But wakeboarding, not really. That's sort of more of a summer sport that revolves around the family here on the lake.
[00:04:24] Dustin Serviss: Were you at all, you know, about your your thirty year old Rex, were you very intentional with with... Again, I'm sure it'll come up, you know, and uncover all the different activities that you do. But I... You know, and this is a a lifestyle wealth podcast. You've got a diverse portfolio of hobbies. And, you know, when you were thirty, you know, did you kind of have that mapped out or was it, you know, already back from your teens? You've always just kept that lifestyle of, you know, being involved with a number of things. And why are being involved in those things, you know, so important?
[00:04:58] Dustin Serviss: And why have they always boiled to the top of your priority list?
[00:05:04] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: They're fun. I I, you know, I mean... And I suppose they're fun for a number of different reasons. I mean, I've always been a little bit competitive in nature, and when I get into something, I like to, you know, do do the best I can in it. Doesn't necessarily mean I'm going to worlds or anything, but, you know, I just enjoy pushing myself and trying to do the best I can. So on a personal level, I I... You know, satisfaction, from doing stuff. And for me, it's primary sports. I, I really enjoy, you know, that kind of stuff. But there's also a lot of, time spent with family doing it, time spent with friends doing it. And,
[00:05:45] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: and I really enjoy that. So, you know, I've always made, sports, an important part of my life.
[00:05:52] Dustin Serviss: What what currently has got you inspired?
[00:05:56] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: With regard to what?
[00:05:58] Dustin Serviss: Sports? Lifestyle.
[00:05:58] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Family. Is there is it,
[00:06:00] Dustin Serviss: a certain thing, or is it, you know, are you experimenting with new sports, activities, hobbies?
[00:06:09] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: I I like to keep things interesting. I like to keep things fun. So, yeah. I mean, I suppose, I'll maybe answer this from a couple different fronts, sort of on a professional level. In the practice, I I like, technology. I like keeping things new. It's what keep... Just kept my career interesting for as long as it's been. I've been practicing now dentistry for twenty six years. So, you know, if I was doing the same dentistry I did when I graduated, I'd probably be quite bored.
[00:06:36] Dustin Serviss: Yeah.
[00:06:38] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: So, I mean, years and years ago in the practice we got into, you know, we embraced sort of the whole digital revolution, digital technology, digital radiographs, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. And we sort of just have been building and expanding on that. We got into, digital dentistry in terms of scanning teeth and building crowns digitally. And we've sort of taken that to the next level. We got a new scanner in the fall and a three d printer, and we sort of added that component to the practice. And, and I just... I enjoy learning new stuff. So that's been a lot of fun. That's sort of, inspired me, if you will.
[00:07:15] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: You know, on a professional level, I guess with regard to sports, we've always done I mean, behind the boat, there's always different things we're playing with in terms of what you can ride. And, a number of years ago, the family started surfing. And surfing was the big the new thing. So we got into surfing. And then a couple of years ago, we bought a foil board. And, my...
[00:07:38] Dustin Serviss: What is a foil board again? I think I know, but I... What is that?
[00:07:44] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: It's like a surf board, but underneath... You never remember the air chair that came out to me in the in the nineties? Okay. It's very much like, an air chair on steroids. Underneath the surfboard or pretty much for that matter, anything, they're mounting foils on catamarans, surfboards, wakeboards, kiteboards, all sorts of things. And all a foil is, is it's like a wing that's attached to a mast underneath your board. And, by changing sort of the angle of how that wing is underwater, it it lifts you up. So when you ride a foil board, you're two... Depending how long your mast is, you're two to three feet above the surface
[00:08:26] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: of the water, kind of just gliding. Okay. So their board isn't actually on the water. The foil is what lifts you up. So the kids got into foil boarding, so I thought, well, hey, if they can do it, I can do it now. And, it was a bit of a challenge. I'm not gonna lie. I mean, I started out just trying... Lying on the board, trying to get up, and that didn't work. And, I mean, obviously, I can't stand.
[00:08:46] Dustin Serviss: So Yeah.
[00:08:47] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: I ended up strapping my, my bucket that I use for wakeboarding onto the surfboard. And, with a lot of practice and perseverance, I guess, for lack of a better way of describing it. Yeah. Few worst word
[00:08:58] Dustin Serviss: size room?
[00:09:00] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: There might have been a few of those that came out on occasion. Yes. And, but yeah, so that was been kind of my new thing. I got into foiling, and I, I wanted to learn to foil behind the boat, sort of step one. And, and surf without the rope, so toss the rope and just ride the wave. And, you know, my, I suppose, long term goal, is I used to do a lot of kiteboarding, as I think you knew, and, I'd like to try, you know, foiling with the kite, and see how that goes. And then, sort of a new sport that's evolved maybe in the last couple years, instead of kites, people are using... They call them wings. So it's like a... Picture
[00:09:39] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: a windsurfer, you know, with the mast on the on the board. The wing would be like the the sail on a windsurfer, except it's not attached to the board. You just hold on to it with your arms. And he used that wing to drag you around the lake. And, I thought that might be kind of fun to try.
[00:09:57] Dustin Serviss: So so... That's the next
[00:09:58] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: thing I'm working on.
[00:09:59] Dustin Serviss: In all the applications, there's a bucket. So, again, one of the things that that, you know, we just came through winter and I know you've been on cat ski trips before is walk us, you know, walk us through how... Like, is there a lot of preparation that goes into your trips or activities, or have you got it super streamlined now? Or is it... You just get the right gear and that's what makes it easier? Or, you know, like, I envision cat skiing. Is that a lot of work?
[00:10:37] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Yep. Yeah. It's a lot of work. And not only not only for me, but but for the people around me because there's just things that I simply cannot do. You know, and negotiating through snow in the middle of winter, is a challenge at the best of times. And Right. Can't use your wheelchair on, things like that. So getting in and out of the camp can be, a challenge, you know. When I went heli skiing a number of years ago, same thing. I mean, that guy's had to basically help lift me out of the bucket and throw me into the helicopter, and then they would take my gear and throw it into the basket and away we'd go. Or same thing when we were cat skiing.
[00:11:14] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: So I do need a little bit of assistance in that regard. And, yeah, there is preparation. What I do is, you know, it's my equipment that allows me to do what I do. So I've gotta make sure I have the right equipment for, the activity that I'm participating in. And in some cases, it's trying to just figure out what I need to do it because there's just not a lot of people. Like when I first type boarded as a paraplegic, there was nothing out there. You know? So I was just kind of figuring it out as I went. And, so sometimes you'll go out and you'll try something and, you know, it didn't work, you know.
[00:11:49] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Go back to the drawing board and, you know, I was fortunate enough that I had a dad that was quite handy in the shop. And we built countless adaptive devices, you know, with, you know, fiber... Seating devices with, you know, fiberglass, but I call them buckets, but it's just a a seating device. So a bucket that sort of holds me, in a a position I need to be in for a certain sport. You know, so we've designed and built various adaptive, you know, seating devices to to use for different applications. So, yeah, a big part of it is equipment driven. When I'm skiing, for example, downhill skiing, I don't have knees or
[00:12:24] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: legs to absorb the, you know, the shock, the impact of, you know, skiing bumps or going off jumps or riding in the park or that kind of stuff drops and whatnot. So it really depends on the equipment I have. So, you know, what shock do I have underneath my bucket? You know, how is that shock tuned? What ski am I skiing on? You know, is my ski well waxed? I I hate pushing. I'm lazy. The last thing I wanna do is have to push on the flats. So, you know, keeping my equipment well tuned makes my life easier when I'm on the hill skiing.
[00:12:54] Dustin Serviss: Right.
[00:12:54] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: You know? So...
[00:12:55] Dustin Serviss: And, you know, I see a correlation between, you have a a fairly big team in your dental practice. Rough, you know, rough how many staff on, like, any given day?
[00:13:09] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: I think we have seventeen. There's seventeen of us. No. We're not all there on any given day. To be honest, I don't know how many staff I have working on any given day. I just
[00:13:22] Dustin Serviss: I just mean, on, as sort of throughout the... You know, in the practice, on the payroll
[00:13:27] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: or Yeah.
[00:13:27] Dustin Serviss: Or, you
[00:13:27] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: know, staff. That's about seventeen of us. Seventeen, eighteen, if you include me.
[00:13:32] Dustin Serviss: Right. And that... That's a a a generous size, you know, a a a great size, practice. And I see a correlation between your leadership and leading the team to get you where you've got today with the dental practice and then leading... It's almost like, you know, you're not... Maybe not leading your friend group, but you've got to coordinate. Is there something, you know, that that your... That, you know, Jim is your father. Correct?
[00:13:58] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: That's right.
[00:13:59] Dustin Serviss: So is there something Jim taught you or your mom taught you that was kind of the thing you still use from when you were, you know, eighteen year old Rex or fifteen year old Rex that you saw that now you have this parallel leadership skill in in business and in personal?
[00:14:20] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Yes and no. Yeah. That's a good question, Dustin. I'm just trying to think how to answer that.
[00:14:28] Dustin Serviss: Well, if there isn't, then it's... You know, that's that's an answer.
[00:14:31] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: In terms of the leadership part, I'm gonna say, I don't think so. No. Neither of my parents in there... In in in the rules, the jobs they have, the careers they chose. My dad was an electrician by trade. My mom, a registered nurse. And, you know, we came from a working class, we call her sort of family. And, the one thing that my parents both definitely instilled on me was was good work ethic. They... My dad was, a bit of a workaholic as was my mom to some degree, and they were always busy. They were always doing something. They they they didn't have a lot of time. So working, they had to work to provide for us.
[00:15:17] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: And that's one thing I think my parents, they worked very hard to make sure myself, my brother, and my sister, you know, had opportunities growing up, to try different sports, to do different things, to participate in different activities, to travel. You know, we... I grew up in a very family centered... A very family centered family, I guess. Mhmm. So, you know, in that regard, I would say definitely I learned work ethic from them. Leadership skills, I don't really know where those came from over the years. And I don't even know that I have great leadership skills. I I I...
[00:15:52] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: You know, without trying to sound boastful or, like, I'm bragging, I think I have fairly good people skills in dealing with people and in in managing people. I was lucky growing up, when I went to university, I had some really good, opportunities. I ended up being a resident advisor, you know, which, helped fund a lot of my education or the, you know, the the room and board part of it anyways. And, there was a lot of training that we had to to manage and to deal with with people, you know, conflict resolution and and such. So, you know, that was an opportunity that I had then that I suppose helped out. And,
[00:16:27] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: part of managing and dealing with people is just dealing with people, you know, having good communication skills. And and and and, I guess, just treating people to some degree, like, that you would wanna be treated yourself.
[00:16:41] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. No. That's a that's a very, simple and effective mantra. You you mentioned the the the workaholic, you know, kind of thing. And and I grew up, you know, in a family where, you know, my father traveled a hundred and eighty, hundred and ninety days a year, business trips, all that kind of stuff. And, you know, I think a lot of people and even so successful people, it isn't that they're down and out, they're successful. They know they need to work hard to be happy or to achieve, you know, something. And then that achievement is gonna help make them happy or work really hard,
[00:17:16] Dustin Serviss: you know, extremely hard and have more money than the average person. And then you're gonna be happy when you retire, you know, or you sell, you know, you get your RSPs or whatever you've got for assets, real estate. And you have a great work life balance now. And I I would love for you to kinda unpack,
[00:17:36] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: You know,
[00:17:37] Dustin Serviss: you work a a slightly reduced work week, but some of your hours are a little bit longer, I think, in the days. So those extra days off, is that something you always did or, you know, is it is it something you realized later in life that I can't keep working at this same pace? Because, you know, I think a lot of people would love to know or love to give themselves the permission not to work less hard or not be a hard worker, but, you know, there's there's a ceiling. You know, workaholism is, you know, eighteen hours, fifteen hours, twelve hours a day. Well, if maybe you could work eight hours a day
[00:18:18] Dustin Serviss: or ten and have a day off and then you have a little bit less wealth when you're sixty. But have all these memories of, you know, the the activities that you're into or memories with your kids or other memories that are important to you, which would be a a better sort of route? So, you know, long winded way of kind of saying, you know, your reduced work week, I love those, And I I would love to inspire other people to try and figure out how to make that work in their own business. But is that something that you always did, or is that something when the money came, then you reduced your work week?
[00:18:55] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: I guess a combination of the two, and I'm gonna answer. And you're right, Dustin. That was a very long winded question. And, in in asking it, a couple of things kinda came to mind. I mean, previously, we were talking about my family and my upbringing and my parents both being workaholics. And I think, in any situation, good or bad, we have the opportunity to learn from that. I I guess, truth be no, and I would consider myself to some degree a little bit of a workaholic. Work doesn't necessarily have to mean your job, but there's a whole other things, you know, that come along with that. It's work around the house. It's, you know, it's...
[00:19:29] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: There's lots of other things that comprise comprise work. So I would consider myself to some degree a workaholic and it's something that I I struggle with to try to find balance at at times for sure. But we can learn from our our parents both by things that we think they've done right and maybe things that maybe they haven't done right or I think we can improve on. And then looking back at my upbringing, I did spend certainly time with my as I alluded to, you know, wakeboarding and whatnot. But there was a lot of times, I can probably count on, you know, two hands number of baseball games my dad attended to because he was
[00:20:04] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: working, doing stuff, you know. Not necessarily work at his job as an electrician. He was kind of eight to five or whatever, but he'd come home and, I mean, we did a massive renovation on the house growing up, so he was always doing something in the shop building or working around the house. So dad wasn't around a lot for us as as kids. And when he did come, and he did occasionally, it was certainly a very special time and, you know, fond memories in that regard. But in looking back, you know, I learned or when I, you know, when I had a family, I kinda thought, you know, I would like to try to be around for
[00:20:36] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: my kids maybe a little bit more than my dad was. And I'd like to say that I learned from my dad right away, and I was able to apply that that that that knowledge, if you will, and be around for my kids right off the bat. But I wasn't. I graduated, I think, started practicing in ninety five. I think I was twenty seven at the time. And, you know, my daughter was born in in nineteen ninety eight. And, it was an early part of my career and I was working, you know, I graduated six days a week. And, you know, I think when my daughter was born, I was five days a week. And I mean, I remember going up to the hospital and picking up my
[00:21:15] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: my wife at the time and daughter and bringing them back home, getting them settled, and then heading back to the office. And, and that's just what I what I did. And somewhere along the line, and I I I can't remember this patient's name, even if I could. I suppose I couldn't share, but I remember chatting with with, with, you know, a patient who at the time was probably in his sixties or so. And and and he knew I worked I worked hard and was working a lot. He knew I had a young family. And he said, you know, Rex, he said, when you look back on your life, you know, you're you're never
[00:21:50] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: gonna, you know, wish that you had worked more, Wish that you had spent less time with your family and more time at the office. He said the opposite is true. You will look back and you may regret the time that you didn't spend with your family. And, I'd like to say that I took notice of that right away and, you know, made some changes, but I didn't. And really the revelation for me came or really kinda hit me when my my daughter went to kindergarten. You know, I remember taking her to kindergarten for her first day of school and thinking, oh, holy shit. Am I am I allowed to say that?
[00:22:24] Dustin Serviss: Oh, yes. You know,
[00:22:25] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: that's what I thought. Holy shit. Like, she's a she's a she's a kindergarten now, and I had missed an opportunity to maybe be around for her a bit more when she was a toddler. And, it was at that point that I committed to make some changes. My son was, two years younger than my daughter. He was born in two thousand. And, at that point, I was working, I think, five days a week, and I dropped a day. And I started working four days a week. And maybe a year later, I went to three and a half days a week. And, so I could have some time off, you know, just the Saturdays and Sundays, but, you know, Fridays.
[00:23:02] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: And then, you know, every second Thursday, I would take off. So I had time to spend with my my kids when they were younger. And, you know, my son and I, we would ski. Every Thursday, we'd go skiing, or I would drive into preschool and just stuff. We just do things together. And, you know, in looking back, I have absolutely no regrets in doing so. Sure, I didn't pay off my house as quickly or pay off debt or do whatever. You know, it wasn't tedious much cash flow as it could have been. But I was in a fortunate enough position that there was enough cash flow to do what I needed to do to support the family and look after
[00:23:40] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: our needs in that regard, and still spend time with my family. And, so, yeah, it was... It wasn't just an epiphany. I woke up one morning and made some changes or something that I... Or when I was a kid. I'm I'm simply put, not that smart. But it was that patient. And then when my daughter, you know, entering kindergarten, that's when it kinda really, you know, it was a bit of a wake up call, I guess.
[00:24:04] Dustin Serviss: Did you have to go through a decision sequence? Because you're a competitive guy. And, you know, you're building your practice and, obviously, more patients, more bookings, more revenue. So you have revenue increases, you know, every business owner has some sort of goal around the growth of their business. Did you ever have fear that if you started reducing your hours, that your revenue was going to go away?
[00:24:33] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Not go away. But interesting story, Dustin, I... When I dropped, a day a week, and, I I guess I'll I'll step back a little bit. I didn't worry about not having revenue. I did certainly consider that my income would be reduced. And, you know, I did the calculations and figured we could, we could manage. We... It would be fine. It would just take a little longer to pay stuff off. And I always, I guess, had the option, you know, as a business owner, I have the the autonomy, the flexibility to do whatever I wanna do. Take holidays when I wanna take holidays, make my schedule however I want my schedule to be.
[00:25:12] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: So that's, you know, I I guess a luxury as a practice owner that that I I had. And I always knew that if I cut my hours back and it didn't work out and should hit the fan, or for whatever reason, it just wasn't working, I could always add that day back and I could work more. So there was always that security blanket, if you will, that I could. But interestingly enough, I found dropping a day, my... The net revenue didn't decrease at all. And the overall practice revenue, you know, over time kept going up. And my personal income didn't really change. And if anything, over the years, you know... And keep in mind, I was, you know, at the time,
[00:25:55] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: you know, I was... Well, maybe within the first ten years of practice. So my business was still... It was still growing at at the time. And so part of that was just growth, and part of it was just increased efficiency. And, you know, it takes time to learn to be a good dentist to to increase your efficiency and and, you know, hone your skills.
[00:26:16] Dustin Serviss: Yeah. No. I think that's... I I see it in a lot of entrepreneurs. I see it in a lot of professionals where they say, I could never do that. Like, I... You know, my revenue would go down. But, you know, again, for successful people, there's a certain threshold of income where if you cut it down ten, twenty percent, you still can afford the bills. You still can save a bit if your spending's in line. So there is... There really... You know, what's the worst that can happen? Your revenue goes down, your revenue goes away. You always can pick it back up. So...
[00:26:48] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: You you can pick it back up. And I guess, Dustin, at the end of the day, you know, and again, you need to put food on the table. You need to provide for your family. There's some things that you you need to do. And and beyond that, you know, it's just saving for the future. And, you know, and, yeah, I just don't know. Sorry. I just lost my train of thought there. Yeah. No. I think you're talking about prudence. Oh, sorry. Success. You know? And I think that's the... The one word you throw out there is is success. And, you know, sometimes I think that we define... You know, how do you measure success? What is success? You know?
[00:27:31] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: And and that's where I think, you know, people may have different definitions of success. And, and sometimes I think, especially in this day and age, success is tied to dollars and cents. You know, the more dollars and cents I have, that must make me more successful. Yep. And if that's how you define success, then maybe that's the benchmark you're using. You know? You know, as as an athlete, as an as a runner, you may define success in in terms of minutes and seconds. You know, as as an entrepreneur and someone in business, you may define success as dollars and cents. But I don't necessarily look at it that way. I remember years ago,
[00:28:10] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: when I graduated, I was a valedictorian. And, you know, one of my closing remarks was, you know, success lies not doing what people consider, great, but what you consider to be right. And, I've often... And I still do think of that, you know, that. And success, I don't, you know, and it's taken me a while to appreciate this and maybe to learn this, but success just isn't about dollars and and cents. There's a lot more that defines success. Success is is being there for my patients. Success is doing a good a good job in the practice. I I derive a lot of satisfaction when I when I when I help people. I like that. Success is being a good father.
[00:28:52] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Success is being a good husband. Success is being there for your your friends. Success is relationships. Or at least in my mind, that's what it is. And everyone, their view of success may be different, but I don't think it's just dollars and cents. And, you know, yeah, if I would've worked more, I would've had more money right now. But...
[00:29:12] Dustin Serviss: I think it's how, it's the evolution of advertising and marketing twenty years ago. And from the studies I've done on happiness and wealth and money and rich and poor and all that kind of stuff, I think a lot of it stems back to, you know, if you wanna, you know, feel good, then you need to be rich and afford certain things and those items were marketed to us. In my, you know, as a summation, it's success is living your values and all those things that you just sort of brought up and, you know, goals so that, you know, a lot of people and a lot of people map out their financial plan based on goals. It's like we wanna achieve this.
[00:29:51] Dustin Serviss: Well, goals are like a really nice checklist, which they guide your your efforts and your intention. But when you're really sort of digging it and unpacking it, it's going back to the values. You know, you mentioned relationships. Okay. Was that more important than money? Okay. Well, then paying attention to your friends' birthdays is is it... Is very important, and it needs to be recognized instead of, you know, your bandwidth being, you know, consumed by, you know, dollars, dollars, dollars. So, you know, again, that's, similar to what you're you're saying. And I don't I don't know I don't know.
[00:30:25] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: A good question, Dustin. You talk about people mapping out their their, you know, financial goals, but why don't we map out our family goals? And maybe some people do. More personal
[00:30:35] Dustin Serviss: goals or... A lot less people do. Hardly anybody... Because it's... You're talking about warm and fuzzy, and you're talking about stuff that, you know, there's not a lot of not a lot of marketing on the topic of values. You know, what what are those and how do they really affect my life? But they are you have a direct correlation to happiness because, you know, if you have all the money in the world, you might be so disconnected from what's actually important that, you know, you're you're buying things and it's giving you a hit for a month. And then whatever that new thing is, that's not doing it for you.
[00:31:11] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: You just move on to the next thing. No. You're absolutely right. And and you talked about... You've done a lot of reading and whatnot. And, when I work out at at night, I often will watch, you know, TED Talks or YouTube videos on different things just for something to do while I'm exercising. And, there was a TED Talk I I listened to a number of years ago, and it was exactly on that, on on, what makes people happy. And it's interesting enough, it's it's... Do you remember who it was? I'll look it up. But here's what I'm gonna tell you, Dustin, and and I think this is a really good thing to look up.
[00:31:48] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: It's one of the longest, studies out there on on happiness. It was done in Harvard, and it was done... This study was started in the, in the late nineteen thirties. I think nineteen thirty eight. Don't quote me on that. And, they took two hundred and sixty some odd students from Harvard, and they basically followed them through the course of their life. Okay. And later on, they actually took some of the offspring of the kids from these, the initial participants in the study. And the study is, to the best of my knowledge, still going on. And, so it is it is, yeah, it's one of the longest lasting...
[00:32:25] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Or it is the longest lasting study out there on on happiness and quality of life. And, to sort of sum things up, really what they found is it's not dollars and cents at the end of the day that when people reflected back on their life that that that they weren't happiest. Some of the happiness... Or the happiness came from, the quality of relationships, whether it be relationships with your spouse or significant other, relationships with family, relationships with friends. The people that had good solid relationships, had the most amount or would recount that they had the most amount of joy, and satisfaction in their life.
[00:33:03] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: It wasn't dollars and cents, it was relationships. Mhmm. So it kinda ties in with what you're saying there. I mean, we tend to focus on, and I think there's a lot of marketing. And you you mentioned, you know, twenty years ago, the marketing that was done on on, you know, money, money, money, and accumulate, accumulate, accumulate. You know? And I understand why they do that because no one makes money if you go out and have coffee with your buddy. Or maybe the coffee shop does, but there's there's not a lot of money to be made in that versus
[00:33:35] Dustin Serviss: fancy cars.
[00:33:36] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Fancy cars and all. Yeah. Exactly. So, you know, as a society, we probably become a lot more materialistic as time has gone on because we're led to believe that if you have this widget, then you're going to be happy. And then once you have that widget, you think, wow, I'm gonna be happy, and you are. But that that happiness is fleeting. And then all of a sudden, you move on to the next widget that you need to be happy. Because that's what they tell you on TV. If I have this, then you're gonna be happy. If I buy this, I'm gonna be happy. If I go here, I'm going to be happy.
[00:34:04] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: And it's not to say that you don't derive satisfaction from maybe having that, but it's it's short lived, and you simply move on to the next goal or the next whatever. Would
[00:34:14] Dustin Serviss: you? You talked about, you know, certain relationships. This is a book, Ikigai. I don't know if you ever have seen it, but it talks about... It studies some of the longest living people. It's the highest. So the Okinawa region in the Asian islands is, has the highest concentration per capita of people over age one hundred. Okay. So one of the things that they talk about in there that's, you know, important from the time that they're kids is something called a mowai. That's like it's m o a I, and that's your friend group. So this is a tight little group of people that help you throughout your whole life, and you help them.
[00:34:56] Dustin Serviss: And they even go as far as... Like, they don't have the word retirement. They don't have the word retirement planning or, you know, that kind of thing because they... For one, they don't retire. They still help keep up their gardens and different things, but they all put a little bit of money every month in a little pot. Not a lot. But then when somebody needs help in the mawai, that pot of money can be doled out to help people or help a child, you know, get a plane ticket to go to university or or they're different things. And as someone who's, you know, I've turned forty this year, so I'm refl...
[00:35:28] Dustin Serviss: Doing this more reflection about relationships and how you... The success, money, focus, focus, focus, work, work, work. You get further away from those core... Like, a good core of friendships when you're younger. And you get family and and life. You don't have those as many interactions. You need to create and be intentional about your. And, again, inspiring from your stories is the the hobbies and sports that bring people together. And, you know, I hear a lot of people say, well, I don't know. I don't really have that big of a friend group, but they don't do any activities.
[00:36:06] Dustin Serviss: So, again, I know you're part of the study club and and staying sharp in in business. What is going to be sort of the next five years of business? What's that gonna look like, or where are your goals? You've got, you know, some kids graduating. You know? Just... You got life changes. Is it bigger? Is it more life, more time with the kids still? Or as you've got... Getting older and the kids are getting older, is that shifting?
[00:36:35] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Well, in sort of reflecting and looking back, there's sort of been, you know, ups and downs, you know, in in terms of time available to spend with friends. But I think you you hit the nail on the head, relationship. Things take work. But I think as, you know, as as parents, you know, before having kids, I I had spent a lot of time with friends because I didn't have the commitment to family or to a lesser degree, which, you know, my wife and I and and whatnot. And then later on, you know, you know, having kids. And it's something I've seen, you know, my friend group, we all went
[00:37:12] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: through, you know, and in in a lot of cases, we did things instead of just myself and friends, we did things, my family, with their family. So we were still spending time together, but it was differently. And, you know, things revolve a little bit more around the family, and you had to make a bit more of an effort to maintain those relationships. Reach out, and it doesn't have to be long. It could be a little phone call every now and then, or, like, just reaching out to someone's birthday and chit chatting or going for a ride. Sports have have always been something that that have brought me together with friends.
[00:37:45] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: But as, you know, as time goes, you know, with having kids, you tended to spend or spend more time. If I was gonna go skiing rather than ski with my friends, I would ski with my family. You know? And then there was a time, of course, when your kids become teenagers and you're the last people they wanna spend time with. That actually is another point that, you know, it was been a pivotal in in life when you start to realize that your kids don't wanna hang out with you so much anymore, and you're not the center of their universe. Their friends and their... Maybe their first boyfriend, your girlfriend all of a sudden become the center of
[00:38:13] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: their universe. And, anyways, I digress. But, yeah, so it went from a period where I skied a lot with my kids, and then my kids didn't wanna ski with me. And all of a sudden, I was skiing with my friends. And now, my kids and my friends and I ski together. Yeah. Now keep in mind, Dustin, as as you know, this is what your listeners will tell you. My older two kids are are twenty and twenty two. And, my twins are eight. So I've got a sort of a second set of kids along the way. And I'm at that stage now where I ski with my older kids and my friends, and I also ski now with my younger kids.
[00:38:47] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: I still am, to some degree, the center of their universe. They like to ski with dad. They like to do things with dad. So Right. I try to make myself certainly available as much as I can to do that. You know, I take Thursdays and Fridays off, and I, you know, I will walk them to school. It rained today, so we drove. But I walk to school. I try to pick them up and just, you know, be there for them when when I can. So
[00:39:09] Dustin Serviss: You've done a great job of summarizing a lot of what I think this question is, but I ask every, guest on the podcast is, you know, what is Rex Hawthorne's ultimate picture of wealth?
[00:39:26] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: You got some really challenging questions, Preston. And I and I I I...
[00:39:30] Dustin Serviss: You've done a hell of a job already describing that. But if there's any sort of closing closing thoughts on what wealth is, and you know, I always say...... Isn't what
[00:39:42] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: wealth isn't what a lot of people would maybe equate it to as dollars and cents. I think wealth is an overall... You know, it's a little bit of everything. Yes. Dollars and cents are certainly... Are are certainly a component of that. And, Dustin, you know, the reality of our conversation here is is, there there there are people out there, and there's a big segment of the population, unfortunately, that, they have to work there five days a week. They have to work long hours. They have to hold down two jobs to simply provide for their families. So, to some degree, a part of our conversation here is,
[00:40:19] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: you know, I'm very lucky in that regard that I can't afford to cut back and still be able to provide for my family. So for a lot of people, unfortunately, some of these... They just can't do some of the things. They can't do that. Right. Hopefully, they can find other ways to be there for their kids, to be there for their family, to to develop relationships, to cultivate relationships. Because I think, you know, that's a huge part of of wealth. And I don't look at wealth as just dollars and cents. Wealth is is having know, a healthy relationship with your spouse or your significant other. Wealth is having a good good friend group.
[00:40:59] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Wealth is having good relationships with your coworkers. You know, those people that maybe don't have a time to have a big friend group outside of work. You know, you work every day with people, you know, and there's an opportunity there to spend time and develop relationships. My staff is very tight knit. They're very close, and it's not expected that they hang out and do stuff together. That's not a mandate that I have. But the work culture in my office is as such, and staff do spend a lot of times together. They celebrate each other's birthdays. They go out. They do things. We have staff functions together.
[00:41:36] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: And participation is very high in in all of these events. Because I pay for it, but they they like it.
[00:41:43] Dustin Serviss: It sounds like fun. We could do a whole another pod... Mini pod sometime about corporate culture because I do... Have known you for so long. I know you do have a strong culture and that's... That obviously provides, there's trust back and forth between you and your staff to... So that each other can do, achieve their their goals and then their values. So thanks. Thanks a lot, Rex, for coming on today. I I had a lot of fun, and I know that, you and I could riff for probably a long time. So thank you again for coming on.
[00:42:15] Dr. Rex Hawthorne: Hey. My pleasure, Dustin. All the best. Take care.
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